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DOUBTS ON A STORMY NIGHT

The night hurls torrents against dark glass,
the trees, unseen, are set to dance.
Tonight this tempest, too, shall pass
with dawn's promise of another chance.

On such nights old men sit and think
of day just gone, as well as all;
lightning flashes blink to blink,
the tick of time just down the hall.

Envy of lives lived fancy free,
and what such freedom must feel like.
Such a life was never meant for me,
my thumb destined to plug the dike.

Decisions always asked of me,
some made badly, some made well.
I've done my best as best I see.
Responsibility is hell.

Alas, the past can't be undone.
It's late and old frame calls for rest
for early comes the rising sun.
Will morning bring yet one more test?

Style / type: 
Structured: Western
Review Request (Intensity): 
I want the raw truth, feel free to knock me on my back
Review Request (Direction): 
What did you think of my title?
How was my language use?
What did you think of the rhythm or pattern or pacing?
How does this theme appeal to you?
How was the beginning/ending of the poem?
Editing stage: 

Comments

something other than “free verse.” I wonder if one can write this without the “i”,s....
Line two, As supple trees are set to dance.
Verse three, line one, "What of" instead of “I think”
In the last verse could you use All instead of “I”

I think {What} of lives lived fancy free
and what such freedom must feel like
such a life was never meant for me {to be}
my (for one) thumb destined to plug the (a) dike

I hope you get the idea of what I am suggesting here. Sorry I don’t have a revision of
verse four. Perhaps this is not a challenge you like. I thought I would share one someone gave to me a while back and it got me to thinking about writing with using “I’s"

vexations

Me writing free verse is the exception lol. I see what you mean by overusing I. Good thing I didn't punch "polished draft" lol. thank you for coming by and input always welcome............stan

author comment

This is my first comment here at Neopoet, so I ask you to be patient with me if make less than perfect sense. I'm just getting my legs.
I liked the poem and particularly the subject. I do have one complaint if you call it that. This is something that I think is characteristic of me more than a large percentage of poets online. I find an absence of fundamental punctuation rattling. The meter in this poem, though consistent, is not without liberties. The punctuation allows these variations in meter to loom larger. A judiciously placed comma can speed or slow when needed. Not that meter should not be a high priority.

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

Welcome to the asylum lol. Sorry the journey took so long. If you have questions, feel free to ask me or any on site. Are you suggesting that poem should be punctuated as if reading a sentence or paragraph or just needs a few comma breaks? Either way, I am always going back and editing and will keep your thoughts in mind when I do so with this rough draft..................scribbler

author comment

I don’t know what i am doing as a poet. Just trying to share what people have said to me along the way. I admire your work and you feedback on what I post.

vexations

We should form a club for poets who don't know what they're doing lol. I hope this was not an apology as I see no reason for such. As I was writing this I thought there were too many "I"s. I am also glad to get your feedback and to read your poetry. I envy your ability get most points across with minimum of words............stan

author comment

Stan, simply adore the introduction...the first line of the poem. I think I got wet in with the visual. ;-) The 3rd line alliteration. "The tick of time just down the hall." A great feel to this, as are most of your poems. However, I'd also love to see you improve the last paragraph; the poem's weakest part, I think. It needs a real-eye-opener-ending.

~A

I've done a small edit. Changed the last stanza a bit. But did not want ending to be too strong. It is meant to convey resignation of protagonist always being pushed into positions of authority. Always glad to have you drop by...............stan

author comment

withoutany doubt

loved

succinct .............stan

author comment

I like the visual effects in the lovely rhyme but it falls out of meter in many places. I think tightening up the syllable counts in each line to be consistent will help. Also, this piece lacks basic punctuation and it needs it in order for readers to understand stops and starts.

The rhyme is good but I think it could be a bit more original. An idea might be:

Night hurls hard rain against black glass,
trees bend their bows to woodland floor;
a tempest's dance too soon to pass
through promises that came before.

Just a thought. All in all, this poem has lovely imagery and a wonderful thought process. Smooth this a bit and do not be afraid to rhyme more difficult words. It will help to avoid the forced rhyme effect and keep this poem from becoming cliché.

I hope you found this critique positive and helpful. Thank you for the opportunity to absorb your words. ~Pamela

.. .

~"It's ALL about the Poetry~

Please join us in The Shark Pool

I find all ideas helpful( even the ones I don't use lol) s-1,l-2 did a little change but wanted to keep idea of trees not being seen intact. Also went over punctuation a bit, but I'm not one who starts all ideas with capitals and ends them with periods unless writing prose or poetic prose.I'm always going back over even my old stuff, so I hope to evolve this a bit with time. Thanks for visit and suggestions.............stan

author comment

If you are just now reading poem this is version I edited by ADDING commas after 2 separate punctuation suggestions lol.Damned if I do, damned if I don't lmao! I'll let this sit a few days now then return and see how it reads. Appreciate visit and suggestions.................stan

author comment

When wesley read this it had NO commas.................now you understand my dilema? LOL

author comment

to comma or not to comma? That is the question.lol................Shakestan

author comment

I will speak chiefly of my poetry in this and maybe make my viewpoint clearer. I'm rather particular about punctuation in poetry. I know I have had a number of people tell me that "poetry has its own rules and doesn't need common punctuation. This is erroneous to me. The first priority for a functioning poet is clarity. Without the poem being understood there is no point to the poem. Poetry (to me) is the same as any other writing. Punctuation is a tool for clarity to be achieved. It must be used as much and not more than any essay, short story or newspaper article. Scribbler, I had trouble with your poem the first time I read it because sans punctuation the sentences had an "unnatural" sense to them. No beginnings, no endings. When I subconsciously added the commas and such myself, much of the confusion left, but that is not the reader's responsibility. As a poet I have a unique advantage other types of writing do not have. With the use of meter I can actually force my reader to read in a very specific way, but without punctuation I am robbing myself of much of that tool. When I think of how my poem should be punctuated I eliminate all of the aspects of poetry and read my work as though a paragraph of prose.
I'm not being as succinct as I would like. Chalk it up to the hour where I am.
My final vote- punctuate no differently than prose.
wesley

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

I expect there could be a book written on how punctuation should or shouldn't be used in poetry. In prose and poetic prose all punctuation should be as in this comment. Periods, commas and all should be as in writing a letter. In my limited opinion, western classic writing, if done well, has a built in scansion which leads the reader to pause where he should and stop where he should without having to be "forced" to do so by punctuation. I take most of my inspiration from the old greats such as Poe, Frost, Longfellow, ect.. They seemed to get by fine without having to follow strict punctuation guidelines. If you found yourself having trouble reading this because of lack of periods or commas, it is probably because the scansion was imperfect and thus in need of improvement.Now I do agree there are times within a given verse when punctuation is need to convey"pause here". But even then in my opinion it is because of structural defect in the poem. I can foresee the two of us having more than one discussion about this lol. Thank you for coming by and giving me something to consider.............stan

author comment

AwEsOme!!!! I lOved iT.....

I had begun to wonder what had happened to you. Thank you for stopping by with such a kind comment..........scribbler

author comment

Hey, thanks for considering my comments as an interesting conversation (I did) and not a bash. I am fresh from another online forum (which will remain nameless) where everyone there had been worked into a frenzy by a member who offered very good critiques, but did so in a less than elegant way. So after a little bit of this, all and sundry were jumping at the slightest "slight". I am probably a little over sensitive from the experience myself. To punctuate or not to punctuate is a complex subject and your comments above have given me suddenly a very different way of looking at it. It is gratifying to be somewhere that poetry can be discussed and not get in the way of personalities or feelings. Gonna have to try an experiment and see if I can write something so crafted that it is read the same with or without punctuation. Thanks again. wesley

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

Things can get a bit rough and tumble here at times also lol. But it all then calms down for a long spell. Just be assured that even the ones who are harsh here have good intentions. I hope you have read community guidelines. They are pretty specific about NOT attacking writers but also make great allowances for being critical toward a poem. ...............................stan PS never worry much about my becoming upset. It is a very rare thing for that to happen

author comment

This one, I will want to see. It can be done, I've seen it done well and I've seen it done poorly - it is quite difficult.

But, I am a die hard and think that we should use the language as it was intended and use punctuation as a necessary tool to understanding the written word. Old school maybe, but I find more and more that people have a hard time with punctuation, spelling and grammar these days and shy away from it in poetry in the name of "art".

~Pamela

.. .

~"It's ALL about the Poetry~

Please join us in The Shark Pool

I have tried it both ways in the past. As I stated above, it is my humble opinion that too much reliance on prose type punctuation can lead to lack of developing the skills needed to write with the skill in which proper flow is achieved without the "crutch".......pause for howls of anguish to die down lol.......of punctuation. There are some poems comma in which it seems to me comma that punctuation can get in the way period. Just as it interfered with previous sentence. Now in prose and poetic prose I feel now that punctuation is critical. And who knows, over time I may be swayed to your position....................stan PS almost forgot to thank you for reading and posting your thoughts lol.

author comment

I disagree. Punctuation is a part of the structure of the English language from the ground up; hardly something to be deemed a crutch. Basic elementary school English; the fundamentals of writing.
This is not something I made up, it simply is. Of course, one can write any way that one wishes.

.. .

~"It's ALL about the Poetry~

Please join us in The Shark Pool

It would appear there are at least 2 different schools of thought on this subject. It is well that our apparently being in these different schools does not preclude us from still appreciating the other..........stan

author comment

I appreciate both schools of thought, but the latter, works written without punctuation as is evidenced by U.S. Poet Laureate W. S. Merwin, comes from the experience of knowing these basic writing skills. One must know it in order to properly leave it out. It is tough to do, but it can be done.

Here is a link I think you might appreciate.

http://www.poetryfoundation.org/bio/w-s-merwin

~Pamela

.. .

~"It's ALL about the Poetry~

Please join us in The Shark Pool

thank you..........stan

author comment

we can not look back or project forward.
we are only in the pleasure or pain of this moment, and both are good emotions

Eddie

Be Content with what you have; rejoice in the way things are.
When you realize there is nothing lacking,
the whole world belongs to you. Lao Tzu

LIFE ISN'T ABOUT WAITING FOR THE STORM TO PASS
IT'S ABOUT LEARNING HOW TO DANCE IN THE RAIN.
VIVIAN GREENE

Yep, we must live in the present, but that present is formed by both past and planned actions. Appreciate your visit and time to comment................stan

author comment

Came back because some of my growing pains here at the "New Site" have calmed and I find a lot of the same conversation. I just read ALL of the comments and I think after bouncing around on both sides of this, everyone pretty much agrees. Better care with our phrases in general can reduce, even limit the need for punctuation, but punctuation has always been and remains a critical tool in written communication. Therefore, become a better writer to limit the need and become a better writer to use punctuation correctly when needed. In short- become a better writer. Thank you guys for the conclusion and Stan, good to know you now on both sides of the pond. wesley

W. H. Snow

A poet is a nightingale, who sits in darkness and sings to cheer its own solitude with sweet sounds. Percy Bysshe Shelley

Learn how, teach others.
The NeoPoet Mentor Program
http://www.neopoet.com/mentor/about

Even Frost used Some punctuation lol..............stan

author comment

Now ask wifey
how much older are ye

you bring life to 2011 memory
then all kick me
poet who
you want t be reread too
blast you!
they bet 3.5 dollars
whether i will be read
when cold dead

who knows
I won't

stan will you?

In 2011 I was already long of tooth and the intervening years have been a bit unkind to me lol.
It's my opinion you are more likely to be read after you are planted than I am. as to being read Now, I apologize but between trying to finish house, recovering from knee replacement and doing a total review of all my scratchings I'm pretty short on time. But fear not, I'll read some of yours over the next few days.......stan

author comment
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